Wednesday, October 7, 2009

Does Anybody Not Read This Blog?

I suppose I'm asking the wrong group of people of obvious reasons, but seriously? I figured there were like maybe 100 people who read this thing and that a lot of them were people I'd never have occasion to meet. Turns out like half the serious players I sit down with have it book-marked on their phones or something. Bakku? Kit? Grinder? How long have you guys been reading?

Anyway, I figured an entire post could be written out of the 8 comments that have gone up since yesterday, so here goes:
Blogger cherish4herish said...

So, is everyone who plays differently from you stupid, or just those of us who take your money?

- "Grinder"

October 6, 2009 4:00 PM

Nope. Actually the people who end up with my money tend to be very competent. You're one of the best players in that game, and I suppose we just drastically disagree on how to deal with Jose. To be honest the theory includes me; from every single other point of view out there (yours, Jose's, everyone) at some point in the past or future I'm going to do something that makes you think I'm a complete idiot. Perhaps that moment happened yesterday actually. A lot of what everyone else said on here is very true and in agreement with my thinking. Everybody makes mistakes, and I'm not going to categorically label someone a bad player because they did one silly thing.
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Blogger Oren said...

I think your theory is a bit off.

Its not that peoples skill deteriorates over time, its just that most people (read: basically "all people") cannot constantly play their "A" game. There are a ton of reasons for this but it comes down to the fact that we are dealing with human beings here.
Tommy Angelo wrote that working on minimizing the time we play our non-"A" game will bring more profit than sharpening our "A" game.

** I really like the blog - and good luck at the tables **

October 6, 2009 4:18 PM

I'm not saying people deteriorate over time, and I'm not referencing people getting off their A-game here. My theory is that if you watch somebody long enough, they are going to do something that makes you question their fundamental understanding of the game and that therefore your opinion of their competence is going to deteriorate. At that point you'll have several choices about how to move forward. You could dismiss them as a bad player and not think about it any more. This would be silly. You can question if your own understanding of a specific piece of the game is off. Not doing this would be silly. You could try to figure out why the person did what they did, so as to diagnose the root cause of the problem instead of just the symptom, so as to more effectively play against them in the future. This would be very hard. All I'm saying is that if you watch somebody long enough, they're going to do something that makes no sense.
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Blogger Kit Cloudkicker said...

everyone who plays LHE is stupid

most players flat out suck

there are a few who are good but in HU pots against you they will take lines that make seemingly no sense and thus you will become convinced they suck

the is another minority that is also good but spends most of the time convincing you (and everyone else) that they suck.

thus, everyone else sucks.

October 6, 2009 5:04 PM

Ah, Kit. As usual the first time I read what you have to say it sounds like complete rubbish. The second time I read it you're a genius, and it takes til the third reading for me to realize you're mocking me. Nice hand sir.
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Blogger Captain R said...

Too much negativity, IMO. Everyone makes mistakes, that's true. And it's easy to characterize any play that someone makes that is different than your own perceived correct play as "bad" or "stupid".

I think you judge players by their mistakes while I tend to judge players by the good things they do when rating how good someone is.

October 6, 2009 9:23 PM

One fundamental difference between you and I, Captain, is that you are inherently a nice person and I was once inherently a nice person. This poker trip has weakened greatly one of my more positive personality traits, the ability to give everyone the benefit of the doubt and assume that people are nice/smart/good until proven otherwise. There's a reason BBB said you were the nicest person he'd ever met, until he went to EG's house that night. I'm working on toning down the negativity and general anger management, but losing for 4 months didn't really help.

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Blogger Burg said...

Finally some stuff I understood. But you probably learned it in High School physics so still not sure your Boston sojourn was necessary.

October 7, 2009 3:56 AM

Well hello Dad. Glad you're still reading.

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Blogger Steve said...

I love the post, Jesse. If the "grinder" is mad he should explain his thought process. I thought putting Fish on 76 was a fine read.

October 7, 2009 6:27 AM

I was a little too tough on the grinder but I was trying to make a point and a humorous blog post all at once. Also, I didn't think he read the blog. Specifically his play on the flop really isn't as bad as I make it out to be, especially if he missed the fishy 4-bet tell. I don't really know how else to explain other than to say that when people call 2-cold then back/cap the flop, they always have a big fat made hand or a truly monstrous draw. An OESD on this board really just doesn't cut it. As I said, 76 of hearts could make sense, but since the grinder had the 6h he could rule that out.
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Blogger DK said...

Wonder what Jose had that hand? Flopped bottom set, top two?

October 7, 2009 12:26 PM

He claimed to have flopped a set, and I'm pretty sure he flashed the grinder his cards.

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OpenID bakkubakku said...

monday was the first time i ever played with any of the 30/60 regulars at the oaks so my reads aren't as refined as yours, but i think "grinder's" flop play is ok. the flop raise i'm kinda indifferent about (from the short time i played with jose i think his flop donking range is huge and you should be folding overcards here if you don't have a heart) but folding to your 3bet would be ridiculous (especially if he didn't notice fish was going to 4b). if he did notice, it's still not that bad but i'd like it a lot less. i do agree that this is a really easy 3b on the river, though

October 7, 2009 6:04 PM

No strategy on my blog please, sir :)

Seriously though, I have folded a lot of hands to the "Jose bets grinder raises" pattern and it seems like a very common outcome at showdown is jack high and 3rd pair. You're correct that for two bets I should probably at least consider mucking unimproved high cards, but in a pot of that size (getting around 10:1 immediate) I just don't think I could do it.

So in closing I'm glad to see that I have a large audience here, but at the same time am a little intimidated by it. For now I'm gonna keep blogging, but eventually I might have to make a decision about it's potential impact on my long term viability.

3 comments:

bakkubakku said...

fwiw, i really enjoy reading your blog and i wouldn't mind if you made fun of me on it :P

bbb: i'm bummed i never got a chance to meet up with you in vegas and couldn't make it when you were in the bay area. next time you make it over to california definitely tell jesse to send me a text

cherish4herish said...

Time to come clean. I'm not actually the grinder, just a dude you've never met who loves your blog. No hard feelings and keep up the good work, sir.

jesse8888 said...

Phew. I figured that was the case (in fact today on 2p2 I set the line at -900) but am still relieved to hear it.